Installing Tile Over A Wood Subfloor
Concrete and Masonry, Flooring, Interior, Kitchens and Baths by Danny Lipford
Installing tile over a wood subfloor is a lot easier today than it was when I started my remodeling career. The old-fashioned mud method — floating a thick mortar bed in preparation for the tile — has given way to using cement backer board. The cement board is inexpensive ($10 or less for a 1/2-in.-thick, 3×5-ft. sheet), easy to cut and install and sufficient for most installations. Among the trade names you’ll see are Durock, made by U.S. Gypsum Corp., and PermaBase, from National Gypsum Co.
Manufacturers provide clear installation instructions with their products, but there are a few other important points you need to know to guarantee a long-lasting installation. For example, I always like to remove the old flooring material so I can check the subfloor for any water damage. Years of water seeping along the edge of a bathtub or shower can cause areas of rot that need to be repaired.
If everything is in good shape, my carpenters drive corrosion-resistant screws through the plywood and into joists below to ensure a firm foundation for the tile. We set the heads of all screws and any existing nails slightly beneath the wood surface. And we use a lightweight gypsum leveling compound to fill and level voids or low spots. We’ve found that if you take this kind of care with the prep work, the finished tile won’t crack with use.
The proper fasteners, mortar, tile adhesive and joint tape are all specified by the manufacturer. Don’t use drywall screws — ever. Another mistake I often see is grout wedged between the last row of tiles and the tub, cabinets or doorsill. Grout in these transitional areas will crack as the floor goes through expansion and contraction. These areas should get a bead of acrylic caulk so the joint remains flexible.
I’m often asked by homeowners if it’s possible to lay down new tile over an existing tile floor. This is not my favorite way to install tile, but it can be done, as long as the existing tile and subfloor are in good condition and the old tile gets scuffed to let the new mortar get a grip. The combination of newly applied mortar and tile will raise the level of the floor by at least 3/8 in. Trimming the bottom of the bathroom door and building up the doorsill usually hide the fact there are two layers of tile instead of one.
177 Comments on “Installing Tile Over A Wood Subfloor”
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May 25th, 2007 at 12:13 am
My husband and I are renovating a rental house and want to use ceramic tile in the kitchen. We were wondering what the proper technique is for installing the tile in the areas where the refridg., range, and cabinets will be installed. Should we tile the whole area or just those areas that will be exposed to the necked eye?
Allen Says:May 29th, 2007 at 9:24 am
Tiles should always be installed under the refrigerator. My opinion is that they should also be installed under the stove. However, under the cabinets is purely by choice. The only obstable is if you have a dishwasher. Installing tiles will typically cause a slight irritation if you try to remove the dishwasher after the fact, because the added height of the ceramic will snag the feet of the dishwasher. Now, if you are removing the cabinets, you may want to put in the ceramic first. This will totally eliminate any potential dishwasher problems. The other benefit is that you have fewer odd cuts to make. The drawback is that you use more materials and, if subbing it out, will pay more for installation. Again, it’s a matter of opinion. I always like to put the floor in before the cabinets in case of a future remodel.
June 7th, 2007 at 5:52 pm
I am installing ceramic tile in my kitchen, I have installed the tile under the fridge, but when the fridge is pushed back ub place the tile cracks. What can i do?
July 9th, 2007 at 1:24 am
I WOULD CHECK THE LEVEL OF YOUR FLOOR ,FIRST.THEN I WOULD GET A GOOD MORTAR FOR THE TILES.MIX IT PROPERLY,REPLACE YOUR TILES .THEN DO A GOOD GROUT JOB .IF ALL ELSE FAILS ,REPLACE YOUR FRIDGE.
August 15th, 2007 at 4:36 am
I have old pine kitchen cupboards, I have varnished them, but the tops are just too soft, and gets stained too easily. i want to tile the tops of counters. how do i go about this?
Ben Erickson Says:August 15th, 2007 at 10:41 am
Adele,
If the old cupboard tops are solid wood, seasonal movement could cause problems, so I would remove the existing tops and store them in case you ever decide to return to the wood look. After you have removed the tops, screw 3/4″ exterior plywood to the top of the cabinet (from the bottom if possible, so you can easily remove the tile tops in the future should you change your mind) and attach 1/2″ cement backer board to it with thinset mortar and screws as detailed above. The edge of the tops can be finished with either bullnose tile or a wood molding that matches the cupboards.
August 29th, 2007 at 8:04 am
I am removing the old particle board subfloor before installing tile. There is good plywood beneath the particle board that I am keeping. I believe the cabinets are installed on top of the subfloor. Unfortunately, at the floor level the there is about a 2 ” indentation before where the base of the cabinet meets the floor. Do you have any suggestions of how I can cut or remove the subfloor so that it is flush with the cabinet? Any recommended tools? I am not having any problems using a circular saw and a crow bar to make cuts and remove the rest of the subfloor.
September 10th, 2007 at 2:46 am
I have a couple of questions. First, I want to install ceramic tile in my bathrooms, currently they have the peel and stick vinyl, the subfloor is plywood, What do I need to install in order to put down ceramic tiles? I have been told two or three different things, cement backer board. a leveling compound, and I was also told I could install it directly over the plywood(which I think would be a mistake because of the properties of wood. If I use the backer board, do I need to remove the cabinets and install it under them also. and also install the tile all the way under the toilet, or just up to it? My second part of the question is I am going to install wood flooring in the kitchen(Floating) the current floor is vinyl and is in good shape with no bubbles or tears. Can I just put done the underlayment over the vinyl and then install the floor without removing all the vinyl? Also Do I need to remove the baseboards and install the wood flooring all the way to the walls(of course with the 1/4 inch gap for expansion, or can I leave the baseboard and install the wood flooring up to the baseboards and cover the edges with shoe moldings. I want to do it correctly but don’t want to go to all the trouble removing the baseboards if I don’t have to. I also am wondering this about hte bathrooms, Remove the baseboards? All the information you can give me would be greatly appreciated. I am also installing new cabinets in the kitchen and am planning on installing the wood flooring all the way under the cabinets before they are put down so I will have a level floor and won’t have any problems if I do have a problem with the dishwasher. Is this a good idea? Thanks for your help.
September 16th, 2007 at 9:47 am
i moved into a new home and i dont like the tile. the question is can i install a wood floor over the tile
September 17th, 2007 at 7:44 am
We are putting in a tile floor in our kitchen and our current cabinets are older and cheaply made. (probobly the original ones when the house was built about 20 years ago.) Eventually I am wanting new ones, but we cannot afford them right now. How do you deal with the tile floor when putting in new cabinets? Can you pop up the tiles along the edges and then reset them after the cabinets are installed? It makes sense to me to do it that way, but I’ve always heard that you should put in new cabinets first and then tile the floor around them. What do you think? This is only the second time we’ve ever put in tile, and it was in a bathroom before. Thanks so much!
September 18th, 2007 at 10:01 pm
PleaseI am waiting for the answer to Kenndy
questions, because I am face with the same problems, don’t know what to do about laying tile on a subfloor or use a backerboard. Help I been dealing with this for about two years. I need some expert advice. Thanks.
October 17th, 2007 at 6:39 pm
Hi.
I am laying tile onto the subfloor (good condition). I am having a problem with tiles popping up. The mortar has a good set on the floor and tile but still comes loose. The mortar is almost granular.
Is there a better (specific, please) mortar I can use?
Also, do you think its ok that I am laying the tile directly to the subfloor (3/4 plywood)?
thanks you
Allen Says:October 18th, 2007 at 11:15 am
Holy cow….so many questions! First of all, we’ve got a show coming up very soon on a bathroom makeover. It would be a great one to watch for some cool tips, including putting down a tile floor.
More specifically, let me see if I can answer some concerns. First of all, tile definitely should not be put down over a wood sub-floor. However, there is a new product by Schluter called the Ditra System. It is an orange colored membrane designed as a backer for tile. It’s thin, flexible, unique in shape which is supposed to make it ideal for putting tile on wood, especially if the height is a concern. Now, understand, I have never used it, so I’m only relaying what the manufacturer claims. But, I’ve seen it at the Builder’s Show and, I have to admit, it looked pretty impressive. It is more expensive, but it could be a better alternative for some of you. Otherwise, put down a tile backer board, preferably 1/2-inch.
Secondly, there’s really no need to remove baseboards to install tile. You can either leave a small space (no more than a 1/4 inch) between the tile and the baseboard, then grout that gap…or you can put down a shoe moulding. Personally, I don’t like shoe on tile. By the way, the same goes for that floating wood floor, Kenny. Just bring it up close to the base and let your shoe cover the gap.
Third, tile goes under the toilet. Before you start a tile job, pull the toilet. You’ll have nothing but frustration and grief if you try to cut the tile up to the toilet.
Mike, I think your popping tiles is directly related to the sub-floor. You need a backer. 1/2″ or try that Schluter product. You can have the best mortar in the world, but you’re getting movement and moisture coming up and it will definitely pop those tiles every time. By the way, use a mortar that is enhanced with latex. Seems to be a better bond.
Kathryn…you shouldn’t have to pop out any tiles to remove old cabinets. Usually, they will come out without disturbing the tile if done so carefully. The trick will be finding new cabinets with the same “footprint” to replace the old ones. If you are going to get custom cabinets, that won’t even be an issue. They can match the base and toekick to fit back into place without having to do any kind of floor work.
Wow….that’s a lot of words! Be sure to let me know about any projects you’d like to see Danny and me tackle on the show. From these comments, I think we need to test that Ditra System out. What do y’all say?
October 18th, 2007 at 12:52 pm
Yes I think you all should come and try the Ditra system out on my basement. ( as I sit here trying to figure out what to put down instead of carpeting that won’t require the expense of a contractor) lol..
November 2nd, 2007 at 4:31 pm
I just read about another product called Blanke-UNI-Mat PRO that seems like it would be wonderful for me to try out in my bathroom, kitchen, utility room, and entryway tile installations I am about to do. I have not yet purchased it, however it is only 1/8″ thick and seems like it will be excellent to match my tile to the laminate flooring (heighth wise). Does anyone have any recommendations for transitions between tile/laminate, if any are really needed. I am considering just butting up the tile to the wood, without an expansion gap. Is this a poor idea?
Allen Says:November 5th, 2007 at 12:17 pm
Justin, we had a similar transition (tile/wood) in Today’s Addition, which just aired recently. You can butt the laminate to the tile as long as they are the same height and fill any gap with a colored caulk to match the laminate. It looks really good. But, if the floor heights are different, you’ll need the transition strip. A lot of the laminate manufacturers make a strip for that purpose and it matches the flooring.
I’ve never heard of the Blanke-UNI-Mat PRO, but I’ll sure look into it. I’d really like to see some of this stuff in a real world situation.
November 14th, 2007 at 9:20 am
I am installing ceramic 12 inch by 12 inch tiles in my foyer (150 sq ft). I am laying the tile on a plywood sub floor above a basement. The floors joist are 19″ on center. Should I install durock before laying the tile? I was thinking 1/4 durock and 1/4 tile which would make my floor height almost the same as my hardwoods in the other rooms. I want to ensure there is not cracking if possible. Thanks Chris
November 21st, 2007 at 10:28 am
your floor joists are to be 16 on center ?
Allen Says:November 21st, 2007 at 4:59 pm
Chris…definitely put down the durock. I prefer 1/2″ for tile floor, but I’ve seen 1/4″ work.
Lee…16-inch on center is nice, but floor joists can be up to 24-inch on center depending on the material used for the sub-floor.
November 25th, 2007 at 9:09 pm
Laid 1/2 durock and all worked out well. Floor seems very stiff so I am happy. Thanks
December 2nd, 2007 at 12:13 am
We had a guy install ceramic tile in our kitchen and did a horrible job. He left dust all over our kitchen, family and pretty much the entire first floor our house. Then not to mention, he removed our island and put the ceramic tile under our dishwasher. Needless to say we are not happy with the work.
But I have a few questions:
1. I know appliances live the fridge and dishwasher should be removed but should an “island” be moved?
2. Do you typical tile under a dishwasher or just put in a backer board? Right now, our dishwasher is not “plum with our cabinets and the feet have been removed. So it’s sitting flat on the floor.
3. When would you use backer board thicker than 1/2 inch???
Thanks in advance for your comments
December 9th, 2007 at 9:40 pm
It is not necessary to remove an island. As for the dishwasher you need not put either the backer or the tile. I usually adjust the feet up all the way and insert a block of wood under neath the appliance to keep it up as far as possible until the job is done. I also make sure to run the backer board under the front feet and also the tile under the front feet going back a few inches. Most dishwashers have the adjustable feet on the front and rollers on the back. As long as you can get the front to be able to pull out of it’s opening the rest of the appliance will come out if you need to do repairs or replacement. Now, you need remove that front bottom panel and block it up and/or find some new feet at a hardware store.
There is no need to use a backerboard thicker than 1/2″. There are ways to raise a floor lever more than 1/2″ but not necessarily with cement board.
December 18th, 2007 at 9:50 am
I am asking this question because I am a real novice and I am not sure that recent work I had done is right. I am having a house built and we had tile floor installed. Here is the pattern of work;
1. Floor and framing
2. Cabinets including refrigerator enclosure
3. 1/2″ Fiber board and tile
Should the fiber board have been installed prior to the cabinets? They had to remove the fiber board and tiled in order to put in the dishwasher. This just does not seem very practical, but then again I am not a contractor by trade. It would seem that the stove and refrigerator enclosures will be a half inch off now. I am not sure how to approach this and the GC keeps saying everything will look fine, but to me that does not mean it is right.
Kind regards
December 29th, 2007 at 3:01 pm
What a GREAT site this is!! My husband and I are getting ready to tile our entrance way, hall, bathroom, dining room, kitchen and laundry room (all connected) We were going to put hardwood floors but have decided last night to do tile. My question is: We both work full time and have three boys; can we start laying the backer board down in stages on the sections of tile that I have just pulled up and walk on it for a few weeks. Because of time, we will be doing this in sections. Will the backer board tollerate walking, possibly a food or drink spill and still do it’s job when we actually start the tiling? The floor under what i just pulled up is rough and dusty and I am afraid that my kids may get cut or splinters. (The old tile is only two years old but kept breaking and moving because the previous owner didn’t lay backer board down and went right over hardwood floor and on the other end of the room over vinyl. He wanted it to look nice for a quick sale) Second question: Can we lay and grout a section of tile like the bathroom and then next weekend do the hall and entrance way, then the following weekend do the kitchen? All the rooms connect. Thank you for what you are doing for people like us!
Allen Says:January 2nd, 2008 at 2:53 pm
Hey Cindy. So glad to hear you enjoy our web site! The backer board is tough stuff, so it’ll take plenty of abuse. As far as grouting in stages….shouldn’t be a problem as long as it’s not too much of a delay in between. The fact that you are planning to grout the full room, i.e. bath, hall, entry, will help. What size tile are you laying? Sounds like it’s going to make a big difference! Send us a before and after picture! I’d love to see it!
January 4th, 2008 at 11:46 am
Hi…I am having a ceramic floor professionally installed in our kitchen. We chose to remove the previous flooring ourselves to save money. My question: I need to remove the subflooring without removing the cabinet bases. Is there any way other than using a cut off blade in a dremel type tool to get close to the base? Thanks in advance for your time and response.
January 6th, 2008 at 6:28 am
Here is a nice adapter to offset a Reciprocating Saw blade – this will do the trick – there are less expensive ones out there. Enjoy.
http://www.drillspot.com/products/348450/Paws_Off_FCA-007_Offset_Blade_Adapter
January 11th, 2008 at 1:02 am
Hi, I am in the process of tiling our bathroom floor and I am wondering if you can help. We have hardwood floors that have been let go for too long that they are not worth saving (it’s an 80 yrd old house). The tub toilet and cabinets sit on top of the existing hardwood floors and I am wondering if I can just install a thin subfloor over the hardwood and then tile on top of the subfloor. There is a squeak in a couple boards in the existing hardwood otherwise it is pretty solid. Could I secure the subfloor to the existing hardwood without jeopardizing the whole project? Clearance won’t be too much of an issue provided we don’t use thicker than 1/4 ” subfloor. Hopefully you can help.
Cheers,
Jeff
January 25th, 2008 at 12:41 am
I have a question: I am remodeling a 1953 original bathroom in a ranch home that is built on a pier and beam foundation. The bathroom floor is constructed of the mesh, concrete mud, then tile. There is NO subfloor. The old floor is almost 1 3/4 inch thick. Should I just tile over the old floor, or remove the tiles only, or remove the entire floor, mesh, concrete and all and install plywood and hardiboard, then tile. I’d rather use the old concrete that is there because it is so sound that I think anything else will likely be more apt to crack in the future. The old tiles are a mixture of 2 inch or smaller smooth matte finish tiles with miniscule grout lines that are flush with the tile surface. Can I tile right over them especially since it is all relatively level and matte finish? Thanks Jon
Allen Says:January 29th, 2008 at 12:53 pm
Hi Jon…If the old floor is in as good condition as you say, there’s really no reason why you couldn’t tile right over it. In fact, the porcelain tile we installed in a recent bathroom remodel (Show #641), was placed on the exact type of old tile bed.
January 30th, 2008 at 3:10 pm
I am going to have tile installed in my home. I have one installor that would use backerboard and one installor that would use the mud method. Which installation method is best?
January 31st, 2008 at 11:18 am
This is a wonderful site. I am remodeling and would like to butt a tile floor right up next to a wood floor without a threshold covering the seam. Is there something you recommend to help? I assume there will be some separation but I would like it to be minimal.
February 12th, 2008 at 11:35 am
I am going to tile my kitchen that has an existing glue-down hardwood floor. I attempted to remove one small plank last night and could not believe how stubborn it was to get up. The plank seperated and left the bottom half still glued down. Some folks at a local tile warhouse siad I could screw down cement backerboard over top of the hardwood and lay the tile. Is this O.K.? If not, what is a good method of removing the hardwood without a scale saw to cut the floor into quadrants. Thanks.
February 13th, 2008 at 11:43 pm
I am about to start a project and my question is if 1/4″ backerboard is enough ontop of an inch of ply-wood(3/4 sub plus 1/4 underlayment)? I also plan to set the the 1/4 inch backerboard in a bed of thin set as well as using screws. Thank you.
February 14th, 2008 at 10:39 pm
I am planning to install tile in my kitchen that currently has lenoleum. I plan on removing the lenoleum and subfloor all together in preparation for the new backerboard. What is the best way to cut around the kitchen base cabinets so I can remove the existing floor up to the cabinets? Do you know of a tool that will work for this?
February 15th, 2008 at 8:35 pm
hey Paul I just did that very thing today. I used a utility knife and repeatedly scored the lenoleum at the base of the cabinet. Also for really tough spots I used a roto-zip with a wood cutting bit.
With what are you going to replace the sub-floor?
February 18th, 2008 at 11:11 pm
Thanks for your reply. I plan on using 1/4″ HardieBacker as a subfloor for the tile. The floor construction uses 3/4″ plywood and I am trying to keep the height to a minimum so my transitions with adjacent flooring isn’t too abrupt.
February 20th, 2008 at 2:58 pm
I had a contractor replace the 12×12 cermic tile in my kitchen and he used an acrylic mastic instead of backerboard and thinset. he said the mastic would be sufficient and that I did not really need the backerboard. Now i have a few tiles that are loose and the grout lines are cracking. My contractor guaranteed the floor for a year and he will come back but I am concerned that he will never fix the problem. What can i recommend he do to these loose tiles so that they do not become loose again? Thanks
February 24th, 2008 at 5:17 pm
I am preparing to tile a kitchen floor. The subfloor is 1/2 inch particle board on top of 3/4 inch plywood. I plan to install 1/4″ hardyboard as a backing for the tile. Do I need to remove the particle board and bond the hardyboard directly to the plywood or can I bond the hardyboard to the particle board? What type of mortor will work on the particle board if any? Thanks.
March 9th, 2008 at 2:18 pm
I have some questions regarding waterproofing before installing tile in a kitchen. Is it necessary/recommended? I have seen two types: One called RedGuard from Custom Building Products (avail. at Home Depot) is a roll on/trowel on product. The second I saw in a DOI book is a thin film/membrane that is laid over an adhesive. Which is recommended? Also, My subfloor is OSB with Exposure 1 rating. Can I use either on my subfloor? What about the 1/8″ expansion joints in the floor – should I avoid filling them with the membrane (RedGuard) or is that not an issue. Thanks for whatever input you can offer.
March 13th, 2008 at 5:19 am
Hi I have a question about porcelan tile installation? My floor is 1×12 boards laid diagonal to the floor joists, which are on 16 in centers.I was hoping to use half inch cement backer board and thinset to lay the tile. I know this is done with osb wood flooring, which comes in 4×8 sheets. A contractor stated I would need to lay osb on top of the 1×12 or remove the 1×12 and lay osb.He said it would be due to the 1×12 wood drawing moisture and flexing during season changes. Installing osb on top of the 1×12 could possibly create heighth problems with the dishwasher,outside door, and transition with the carpet. thanks
March 17th, 2008 at 4:04 pm
I may be in trouble…….
I was looking for some advise on Grouting and have read about applying tile.
Here’s the issue, I put Ceramic Tile and Thinset directly to 3/4″ OSB on 12″ engineered trusses 16 on center WITHOUT A CEMENT BACKER BOARD…… I am not going to rip it all up to start over now.
My question:
What should I expect and how long before I endup replace or….. will it most likely be OK?
March 21st, 2008 at 11:05 pm
We have 1/2″ plywood subfloor in our kitchen. Tiler is planning on installing 1/2″ Durock over this and laying 13″x13″ porcelain tile. Will this subfloor be strong enough?
Thank you for your help
March 25th, 2008 at 10:52 pm
hi i’m trying to install porcelain tiles in two bathrooms( upstairs). the bathrooms have vynil flooring now.
my first question is : can i just install backerboard over the vynil and then the tiles? and if it’s the case do i need 1/4″ of 1/2″ backerboard for the application?
second question: if i decide to remove the vynil( if it’s the best option), do i have to remove only the sheet of vynil or is there something else that i have to remove or install before installing the backerboard( the house was built in 2004 so the subfloors are still in good shapes)
thanks
March 30th, 2008 at 1:57 pm
Hi i have a question i was wondering if you can help! I recently layed ceramic tile under my wood stove in my family room. They have cracked and broke all over… I was then told that i needed to have a sub floor… What do i do? Would 3/8 in plywood work? I’m so confused… Please give me your advice
March 31st, 2008 at 11:21 pm
I’m replacing my tile in the foyer/entryway of my home. My husband pulled up all the old marble, and we are replacing it with ceramic tile. I have a contractor who told me that he plans on laying concrete first instead of Durock; have you ever heard of that?
Durock was used in both of my bathrooms.
April 5th, 2008 at 3:44 pm
I am interested in putting ceramic tile in our laundry room where we now have linoleum. Because it will be difficult to remove the washer/dryer and extra fridge, is it possible to move the appliances out from the wall and tile there, then wait until the tile is dry then move them back over the new tile and do the rest of the floor?
April 7th, 2008 at 4:08 pm
Hi I am tiling the floor in my bathroom, should I remove the toilet and tile underneath or should I tile aound the toilet.
April 11th, 2008 at 2:48 pm
I am turning a 3×5 wash closet into a 7×10 bathroom. I have everything framed out and the plumber is coming in to rough in everything. My question is the flooring. I exposed the subfloor and and is 2×5 wood planks. What should i do if i am to put tile down? should i rip out the subfloor and put in 3/4 plywood, then use durok, or a self leveling compound? or do i put self leveling compound ontop of the existing subfloor? do i put plywood on top of the sub floor and then durlok or self leveling? Does the bathroom floor have to be level with the floor in the hallway ( it is about 3/4 higher right now) whould should i do?
April 11th, 2008 at 7:56 pm
Jackie, same question was answered several postings above yours.
April 11th, 2008 at 7:59 pm
Reading all the questions & answers is a great lesson in what to do & what not to do concerning tiling. I feel like I’ve learned alot in the time it took to read through.
THANKS FOR MAKING THIS FORUM AVAILABLE
April 11th, 2008 at 8:07 pm
Jackie, Sorry I shd have been more specific. See middle of October 18th ‘Allen’ posting above for toilet/tile answer.
April 24th, 2008 at 3:51 pm
Hi,
Do I leave a space around the island in the kitchen when putting down ceramic tile as I will wround the walls and use trim or should I just put the tile flush with the island?
Thanks,
Ron
April 25th, 2008 at 12:25 am
We are building a raised hearth for under a wood burning stove. The hearth is BCI’s topped with 3/4″ OBS subfloor. The next layer is 1/2″ Hardibacker. The final surface is ceramic tile.
Is motar needed between the OSB and Hardibacker? If yes, what is recommended for under a woodburning stove. Can we use the same motar or thinset for the tile as well? Or do you recommend a different approach?
April 25th, 2008 at 1:03 pm
Hello,
I think I really messed up my tile project. I recently removed lenolium from my bathroom floor there was still a lot of backing from the lenolium left on the floor that I didn’t remove. On top of that I put the tile on the original wood floor. There is an area in the bathroom that creaks. I used the morter that I was told to use, but now I am really afraid that after my hard work and sweat, my floor is going to crack. What are the chances of that happening and how can I prevent it or fix it? I plan on doing a little more homework for the next project I take on…
May 4th, 2008 at 9:21 pm
Hi,
I’ve read through all the comments and I see that others have had the same issue I’m having, but I still don’t fully understand how the solution. I’ve got 1/2 inch hard wood flooring in my kitchen and I’m replacing it with tile. The flooring was laid first and the cabinets on top. What tool do I use to cut around the base of the cabinets? I have a roto zip saw, but did not see an attachment that would work. Thanks for your help in advance!
May 7th, 2008 at 6:06 pm
I am installing ceramic tile in my kitchen, dining room and laundry room which are all seperated by standard door ways. My stepdad came to town and began laying the tile in the dining room. He did not have time to lay it in the kitchen and laundry room. We installed backer board, thin set and then tile. When we got to the kichen door the backer board and subfloor ware perfectly even and it would allow us to continue without using a transition strip. A neighbor suggested that we just put mastic over the subfloorand tile…not using the backer board. Is this possible? If so what is the difference between mastic and thin set??
Thanks for your help, I am clueless!
May 8th, 2008 at 1:50 pm
We are right smack in the middle of tiling our shower-tub.We were told by an employee at a home depot in the tile department that we should tile the walls over OSB and not the drywall. The employee stated that the drywall would absorb the moisture of the adhesive, and that the OSB would not. Soooooo.. we install OSB on the walls of the shower-tub, over drywall. So, here I am reading these forums…and now we are out of finances to re-do or install any other kind of walls. We are out of finances because the township made a mistake on our building permit on another home we had spent 4 years building, and had to sell it as a ‘camp’. Thats another very painfull story at a loss of about $80,000…so now we are starting over, just one mile up the road. We are remodeling and guttig walls..etc, but now we are on a very very very tight budget. So, I need encouragement that we can do this tile on OSB and is there any kind of paint or sealer that I need to paint over the OSB to help protect it before I put the tile up. We are also ‘busting up’ the tile pieces. We want a mosaic look, no straight lines to have to deal with..we’ve dealt with enough, we don’t need to have to deal with straight lines too.
… and if you’re wondering, we did not sue the township, small town, turns out it was a family member that made this shocking mistake, and would have lost his job, and he has 2 babies at home..so we opt to sell the home as a ‘camp’ and move on. So back to encourageing us. Since we did go on the advice of the home depot employee, is there anything we need to do to the OSB ‘before’ we install our ‘busted up’ pieces of tile?
Allen Says:May 9th, 2008 at 7:49 am
Hey Liz….A lot of people tend to interchange the words “mastic” and “thinset” with the mentality that they are the same thing. And, sure enough, both are good adhesives. Mastic is usually used in dry locations and CAN be used to set floor tiles. However, thinset is what I recommend for tile flooring, especially the modified version that has a latex additive. It will do a superior job and is easier to work with. Of course, this is all just my humble personal opinion..:-)
May 9th, 2008 at 4:28 pm
We paid professional to lay 12×12 tile in mudroom,kitchen and foyer last summer. Floor is 3/4″ T&G ply, 2×10 joists 16″ OC. Put 1/4″ hardibacker on ply, screwed in app. every 8″, no thinset under it. I have loose tiles in foyer (not enough thinset around edges), but what concerns me more is the “crunching” sound in the kitchen high-traffic area, where no grout is cracking (yet). I can pull up loose tiles around edges of foyer and reset/replace them, but what do I do about the areas that are just noisy, look sound? Should we put in more (1″ or shorter) screws from underneath (basement)?
May 11th, 2008 at 4:11 pm
My home is on a concrete slab. If I am going to replace all kitchen cabinets and tile the floor, optimality, should I tile the whole floor then place the new cabinets on the new tile?
May 18th, 2008 at 3:27 pm
A friend told me that I should use a layer of thinset between my backer board and subfloor to create a solid surface that will prevent tiles from loosening or cracking. Another friend said that if I do that I would have to rip out the subfloor if I remodeled in the future. What is your suggestion?
May 22nd, 2008 at 8:55 pm
Hi good insites thank you, do you have a phone number for ditra systems for tile over wood and what about lows in sub floor.
john
May 26th, 2008 at 7:49 pm
I am preparing to lay VIFAH Diagonal Deck Tiles
over a recently rebuilt wood subfloor of a small (4′x10′) bathroom. These indoor / outdoor
eucalyptus wood tiles seem perfect for this project, but I have two concerns:
The tiles are raised off the floor by plastic
interlocking grids under the wood slats (12″x12″) which snap together and require no glue, nails, etc.; nor grout between them.
What should I use over the subfloor to allow
water and moisture to wick between slats and not cause rot and mold?
Also, have you tried this product, and do you have any other product options for a wood deck type flooring in the bathroom?
Thanks!
June 6th, 2008 at 5:09 pm
My wife and I are looking to finish off a small outside courtyard and were considering tile vs pavers vs concrete.
Can we build a subfloor for the courtyard, and tile over it, or are we doomed to failure and replacement with pavers or concrete?
June 12th, 2008 at 5:58 pm
My kitchen has hardwood floors on top of 2×4s (wide side down)on top of a concrete slab. I’m wondering if all I have to do is put down backer board to be able to have a tile floor. My bathroom already has tile, but I would like to take up the tile and put down new tile so that the floor will be the same height as the hallway. How would tile have been laid in a 1955 ranch? If a mud job was implemented how hard will it be to take the tile up?
June 16th, 2008 at 1:32 pm
I was told by a sales rep for porcelain tile. He told me that I should space the hardy board and thin set in between them, and thin set underneath them to reduce vibration cracks. Is this necessary? What are some other ways to help if I already placed the hardy board?
June 26th, 2008 at 4:16 pm
To follow Mr. Perez, is it necessary to leave expansion spaces between the hardy board or at the edges meeting the wall?
June 27th, 2008 at 7:33 pm
This is a great site! I am a disabled housewife and my husband works odd hours and all the time. I am determined to give our kitchen and adjoining dining area a face lift. I have started the removing years of stain, varnish and paint that was on the cabinets when we moved in and also took a peak under the cracking ceramic tile flooring. I found that there was no type of moister barrier between the sub floor which looks like plywood and the ceramic tile itself. I am hoping to get some suggestions on how to handle this. I want to make sure that when I do rip up the flooring that I make sure that what ever type of flooring I replace it with will have a good sound sub floor under it so it will last this time. So I guess I have many questions the first being: After I rip up tile, what can I lay over the sub floor to make sure that it will be sound and water resistant without having to put a new sub floor in. (the sub floor should be still in good condition)?
If I choose to install a floating floor all the way through from dining area to kitchen, what steps should I take to make sure that it is done correctly? (the dining room already has a wood flooring on it however it appears to be laminate and needs to be replaced because of water damage in front of back door area? Please help with advice and maybe good inexpensive materials to use. Thank you so much
Determined
June 28th, 2008 at 4:54 pm
I installed my down stairs tile on concrete and it turned out great but now i have moved upstairs and people are talking about water damage from the thinset which is where i learned about back boarding then something came to mind, the walls are always bowed and thier is a space between the boarding and the wall, what do i use to seal these areas, and should i put plastic under the backboarding to decrease the risk of water damage.
P.S. i live in vegas
July 2nd, 2008 at 6:58 pm
When my house was built, the builder encompassed my jetted tub with 3-4 inch square tile. He only left a wooden access door for servicing the motor. Now I see that this was not such a great idea, since, I now need to conduct some maintenance on the push button on/off switch, which by the way has no access and can not be reached from the motor access door. When I removed one of the tile I noticed that there’s wood in which the tile is attached. Also, the tile is just hanging on the wood without any backer board, is this normal? Once I decide to remove enough tile and cut a hole in the wood to access the switch, how will I replace the removed tile with some type of wooden access door. Is the process of attaching tile to a verticle base the same as attaching tile to a wooden floor (horizontal base)?
July 17th, 2008 at 1:18 pm
I am getting ready to lay ceramic tile in my kitchen, hallway, and both bathrooms. I have pulled up the sticky back linoleum. I have 3/4″ plywood floors. I have been told that I can use Ultraflex2 mortar without using the cement board. Is this okay?
July 27th, 2008 at 2:39 pm
Lots of questions. Where are your answers ?
August 6th, 2008 at 3:49 pm
This is in response to Mr Danny Lipford’s statement regarding the installation of ceramic tile, porcelain or natural stone over a wood subfloor. Please read carefully.
If someone tells you that a tile installation is only as good as its foundation and its preparation, you better believe it. In the case of tile floors the structure must be a suitable one. Not all structures are suitable for a tile installation. Floor deflection is one of the major causes of a floor tile installation failure.
The maximum allowable deflection for any ceramic tile floor is what is known as: L/360.
Some of the more common and readily available hard-surface tile underlayments are called “cement board” or “Cementuous Backer Units” or in the trades “CBU’s”. CBU’s come in several forms and generally two nominal thickness sizes 1/4 and 1/2 inch.
Half-inch CBU’s are always used over wall studs; shower walls, tub surrounds, steam rooms, etc, never use the quarter-inch version on walls or ceilings. Quarter-inch and/or half-inch CBU’s however can be used on floors. You should know that CBU’s offer ABSOLUTELY NO STRUCTURAL BENEFIT and they are simply a proper “tooth” for the tile-setting materials to bond with. CBU’s are not in any way detrimentally affected by moisture or water submersion. Any structural improvements required to meet minimums should be completed before the CBU’s go into place.
A traditional CBU is basically a sheet of cement and aggregate between two layers of fiber-mesh. There are other variations that have the same attributes and there are versions that have a waterproof covering on one surface. All CBU’s used on the floor are required to be installed in a full bed of thinset. The thinset is used not to bond the CBU to the substrate but instead to insure there are no voids anywhere under the CBU. In addition fasteners are used to install the CBU products. Follow the printed manufacturer’s instructions available with all CBU products.
In addition to the CBU style underlayments there are also a variety of plastic underlayments that serve a slightly different purpose. These plastic underlayments are not necessarily interchangeable with the above CBU’s and usually have a specific purpose.
Here are a few (underlayment related) things you wouldn’t want to do when installing your new tile.
• Tiling directly to plywood isn’t recommended.
• Tiling directly to vinyl flooring also is not recommended under most circumstances.
• Tiling directly to particleboard or luan plywood is FORBIDDEN, it just doesn’t work. In fact, here’s what the industry has to say on that subject:
AMERICAN NATIONAL STANDARD SPECIFICATIONS FOR THE INSTALLATION OF CERAMIC TILE (ANSI-1999) ANSI A 108 Page 13
AN-2.4.3 CAUTION: Wood-based panels such as particle board, composite panels (veneer faces bonded to reconstituted wood cores), luan plywood and soft wood plywood all expand and contract with changes in moisture content and are not recommended as backing materials for ceramic tile…
In english. DO NOT USE CEMENT BOARD of any kind. A mud sub floor over wire mesh and felt is the only way to ensure a proper foundation. In addition to the structural properties of a mud sub floor it also takes out any imperfections in the existing floor. Cement board follows the flow of the existing floor and so will the tile.
It is advice like this and installers who practice these methods that give this trade and industry a bad reputation.
August 8th, 2008 at 3:32 pm
we have an old house that currently has carpeting in the kitchen that absolutely needs to be replaced. When we pulled up a section we saw that there was a vinyl tile beneath the carpet (which has a lot of glue on it from the carpet installation) and beneath that is the original hardwood floor. Our first preference was to keep the hardwood floor, but given all the glue and vinyl tile it may not be possible. Is there some type of coating of layer that can be put on top of the vinyl (glue surface) so a new hardwood or laminate wood can fairly easily be installed? Thank you!
August 10th, 2008 at 1:37 am
I am going from a bathtub to a ceramic tile shower (hopefully). My concern is, my house is on piers and I’m scared if I put in a tile shower my house will settle and the tile will crack or slide. Is there a way I can install tile safely and not have this happen?
August 11th, 2008 at 5:38 pm
Your question is a good one. I have done several custom tile & stone installations for customers who reside on waterfront property and whose homes are on piers. The installation process is the same for your particular home as one that has been constructed on a concrete slab or foundation. However, before any installation is started you need to take into consideration what kind of settlement issues have occurred previously if any, and the cause for them. If your home is structurally sound and has had no prior cause for concern you should be fine. I have seen settlement cracks occur in home’s built on top of concrete slabs, foundations, and piers. If the ground is going to shift or move the force is so great that there is nothing you can do about it, but this should not deter you from wanting to accomplish this project. The most important thing to remember is to contract someone who is licensed, insured, and who uses quality materials for the installation of your project.
Sincerely,
Jon
August 14th, 2008 at 1:05 pm
I am considering tiling my kitchen, laundry, and powder room. Our existing floor is vinyl/inlaid. Subfloor is 5/8″ OSB glued to 2″x10″ Fir joist, 16 o.c. with 5/8″ plywood underlayment screwed to joists. The maximum span is 13′ and the estimated L value is 458 or maximum deflection of 0.341″.
I am considering using Ditra after applying screws every 6″ o.c and using an embossing leveler. Will an expert in the industry care to comment on this potential floor system? Does anyone have any feedback on the Ditra?
Thanks
August 16th, 2008 at 8:28 am
I want to replace the tile under my wood stove in my family room. Is there any special type of tile I need to use that will be sturdy enough to support the wood stove as well as heat resistant? Is ceramic ok? 1/4 inch thick enough? Do I need a layer of some material before the tiles?
The wood stove isn’t a very big one, it stands about 4 inches off the ground on 4 legs. Currently there is just a layer of tiles on top a sheet of plywood on a built up platform. Any help in this matter will be appreciated. Thanks!
August 16th, 2008 at 5:55 pm
Thanks NC Tile & Stone for the CBU information. That helps.
I’m considering laying wood floors and ceramic tiles through out my first floor…where there is vinyl and carpet now. Do I lay the wood floor first or the tile to achieve that even transition between materials without using transition strips?
First Major DIY project…and am a little intimidated. Thanks for the advice.
August 19th, 2008 at 10:04 am
l was thinking of putting tile on the second floor. Can l do this? Is the floor strong enough? Our house is 8 yrs old. The joist are 16 inches on center, and we have a plywood sub floor.
Also..
l just lifted the carpet off the floor up there, my kids have spilt drinks etc and l’m not sure if the floor is ok or patches need replacing. How can l tell whats good and whats not good enough to keep.
Thanks
Jen
September 4th, 2008 at 2:11 pm
We were painting the wall behind our refrigerator/pantry cabinets and accidentally broke a tile and cracked another. The tiles broke way too easily so I was suspicious and when removing the pieces of tile I found wood rot which caused a hollow effect under these tiles (tile over wood subfloor). The house is 25 years old and this is the original tile. This floor in question is the second story of a two-story home. Is there any easy way to fix this? Who should check it out and how can it be repaired with minimal damage to first story ceiling?
September 5th, 2008 at 3:20 am
I am seeing in the distance the Home stretch on my basement re-do. Two current Dilemmas.
First one: I am installing a plywood subloor on 1 3/4″ joists on concrete. I had planned to use 1 inch plywood for a really firm subfloor amenable to any eventual floor covering, but I see 3/4″ subfloors bandied about everywhere. Is 1 inch overkill? There is a moderate possibility an upright piano might make its way down there eventually. (I am putting things together so that if I ever (Heaven forbid!) need to repair/reinforce/inspect I can remove sections of either wall or floor without unduly disturbing surrounding sections.)
Second dilemma: Do I install the drywall right to the concrete floor and then install the subfloor, or keep the bottom edge of the drywall at or slightly above the subfloor level? I have explored and searched and have not had much luck from online publications I can find about this.
With great thanks,
Tyler.
September 13th, 2008 at 1:56 pm
Love this thread- it’s a big help. DIY’ing my master bath, to include re-tiling the floor. In tearing up old tile, discovered that it was installed old-fashioned way- lots of mortar right on top of wood subfloor. Tiles are coming up easily, but mortar is not. Any hints to make this demo (removing old mortar) easier? Or do i just use a self leveling compound across the floor before installing backer board (rather not as this will make things too high.)
Thanks.
September 14th, 2008 at 9:20 pm
I am currently in the planning stages of a pretty major kitchen re-do. The floor is currently parkey and I am planning on removing it and installing tile. As I am going to be replacing the cabinets & appliances, I was going to start by removing everything in the room and tiling the whole floor. I am planning on having an island in the middle of the kitchen with bar seating. Is these feasible to have an island over tile flooring? If so, what would be the best way to keep it from moving? Thanks.
Ben Erickson Says:September 15th, 2008 at 9:27 am
To Chris B:
The thick layer of mortar mix served the same purpose as today’s cement backerboard, so you should be able smooth it out and apply new tiles on top of it without using cement backerboard.
Ben Erickson Says:September 15th, 2008 at 9:35 am
To Liz B.
You can either put the island in place and tile around it (in which case the tile will hold it), or tile first. Islands can be pretty heavy, so you might not need to attach it to the floor at all unless your building codes call for it. If you do attach it to the floor, attach blocks of wood to the floor inside the island with concrete anchors, then set the island over it.
September 15th, 2008 at 11:57 am
First I have an older home with 3/4 subfloor with tung and grove. I bought 1/4inch cement board. I want to tile with 1/2 travertine tiles. Should I use a vapor barrier between the sub and cement? Also would you please explain why you should never use deck screw to attach the two floors? Also the room is a little office space 6′x8′.
Thank you
Thomas
September 16th, 2008 at 11:39 am
I removed an engineered wood floor that was glued down to tile. The tile came with it.. It is in an entry way and I was going to install tile there anyhow. There is a 2-3″ cement/mortar bed the tile was on that is still in tact. There is the remanats of the thinset on top. Can I just knock down the thinset high spots and apply a new layer of thinset to secure the new tiles or is there somthing I should do to prepare the mortar bed? Thanks, John
September 25th, 2008 at 6:18 pm
We are going to tile our entry way, and had to rip up some old linoleium, that was on top of linoleium
Under that is a soft wood subfloor, and I was wondering if we need to install anything else on top of the subfloor or can we just tile over the softwood?
October 13th, 2008 at 7:20 am
We are trying to tile our outside bar, but haven’t been able to figure out what to use for a base layer. The bar is currently made out of pressure treated plywood on the sides and we want to tile over that. I know we need some kind of waterproof barrier to protect the wood from warping. Suggestions we’ve gotten include Tyvek, and an ice guard product typically used on roofs. What are your thoughts?
October 18th, 2008 at 4:12 pm
We are tiling our adjoining kitchen and living room with 12×12 porcelain tiles. House is older and floors are very strong and don’t flex. We are going to use 1/2 inch cement backerboard. Only problem is floor is painted. Can we use a type of thinset that will adhere to these floors if we rough up the surface….We really don’t want to put down plywood over the floors as that will raise the floors over and inch higher than floors in adjoining rooms. I checked with tile store and they said we could mix raw thinset with a latex material that would make it adhere well, but I just wanted to get your opinion too. Thanks in advance for your reply…
October 19th, 2008 at 11:42 am
we live in Kenya East Africa and operate a small guesthouse for a mission hospital. we have a second floor that is all wood and the showers are leaking and nasty. we want to replace the tile with new 13 x 13 tile. can we do this and what needs to be done?
October 26th, 2008 at 3:34 pm
I need some advise with our bathroom. We live in an unstairs condo with a gybcrete sub-floor poured throughout the place for sound proofing. We tiled the bathroom floor over the gybcrete almost two years ago. The grout started cracking 9 months later. We tried replacing 8 tiles and sealing the gybcrete under those nine tiles a year later. 9 months later we were getting more cracking grout. We went to pull the tile yesterday were we had sealed the gybcrete and ended up pulling the tile along with the 3/4 inch of gybcrete. We then proceeded to pull the entire gybrete sub-floor out of the bathroom area. What would you suggest to replace the gybcrete and how would you make sure the replaced materical connects with the hallway and laundry room? The floor joist are 24″ apart and I have screwed down the plywood that was under the gybcrete. I’m just a bit skeptical on what I need to do now to proceed. Thanks for your help!
Bob
October 28th, 2008 at 9:08 am
I am looking to put slate down in my entry way of my house. there was carpet there. I have it down to the subfloor. Should I use a tile backer board for the slate?
October 29th, 2008 at 6:01 pm
hi… I am planning an interior art project… a wall mural. I wish to install a mix of glass & ceramic mosaic tiles (3/8″ to 1″) onto a series of 3′ x 3′ x 1/2″ exterior grade plywood panels that will be bolted onto a sheetrocked wall. I plan to use a latex-modified thinset & grout. I am getting mixed opinions regarding how to prep & seal the plywood… whether to use a wood sealer, urethane or some type of primer… to keep the moisture from the thinset absorbing into the plywood & still allow for good adhesion to the thinset. Your help is appreciated.
November 5th, 2008 at 12:18 am
Help!! Want to tile my kitchen. It’s 10′ by 19′. Home was built 6 yrs ago. Subfloor is 3/4 inch osb over 24 inch centers. I want to add 1/4 inch or 1/2 inch HardiBoard, then lay ceramic tile. Can I do it? Will the floor be rigid enough? I don’t feel any “bounce at all”. Is my project doomed?
November 5th, 2008 at 12:52 am
Sorry, if it matters the joist are 2″ by 12″. Unsupported span is 10′.
November 14th, 2008 at 7:57 pm
We are tiling a bathtub/ shower combo that has a window recessed over the tub. Because of the window’s design, my contractor lined the window sill / jamb with pine as opposed to cement board (he had to plane the wood to the right depth). Since we can’t use cement board / hardi, is there any way to waterproof the wood sufficiently to avoid problems down the road. Is it sufficient to just prime the wood?
November 17th, 2008 at 1:22 pm
We need to replace a toilet and want to tile the bathroom too (we have carpet now and want to get rid of it)…….my question is do we replace the toilet first or tile the bathroom first.
Thanks
November 26th, 2008 at 6:45 pm
Wow what a very informative site!! Thank you for having it!
I have begun to remodel my bathroom. I would like to make a fully ceramic tiled shower. The sub floor threw me for a loop though. It appears to be 2×6’s laid diagonally with a small space between them. I’m thinking that I may need to replace the subfloor with a solid plywood before I can build the shower, would that be correct? Also, someone has mentioned to me that I need to “Hot Mop” the area. I didn’t understand exactly what he meant…any suggestions?
December 8th, 2008 at 12:10 pm
I am in agreement with most of you that this is one of the most impressive sites I have come across. Any comments would be appreciated concerning my kitchen floor install. Due to a settling foundation in a very old home (which has been subseqeuntly reinforced), the 3/4 inch hardwood floorboards in the kitchen and dining room are uneven. The previous owner put vinyl over the hardwoods. Therefore, I put down 1/4 inch particle board, applied a layer of self-leveling cement, and plan to put down 1/4 inch backer board. First of all, the self-leveling cement is cracking. Is it OK to lay the backerboard over the cement? Secondly, is 1/4 inch backerboard enough? I would like to keep the height consistent with new carpet that was installed. Thanks for your suggestions.
December 24th, 2008 at 10:15 am
I’am installing a new floor in the master bath.the owner before has carpet there now,when I removed the carpet and pad I found just chip board.I want to install a pell and stick tilles,DO I need to put down a luon sub-floor first,for smoothness. And is the anything else I should put down before applying the pell and stick tile?
December 25th, 2008 at 1:39 am
I am remodeling my kitchen. I have 3/4″ particle board over 1/2″ plywood sub floor. The kitchen floor meets with hardwood floors at hallway and livingroom. All are level now but I want to put tile in my kitchen without having a big transition. What do I do? There is a basement under the kitchen (floor joists are 2×10 16″ on center) and have a solid 30 year old home.
Thanks.
January 12th, 2009 at 11:22 pm
I am having a new home built. The tile installer is suggesting to tile directly over the 3/4 osb board using a modified thin set. Should a cement board not be used?
If not cement board, what system is best?
Ben Erickson Says:January 13th, 2009 at 9:20 am
Hi Jason,
I would put either cement backer board or one of the thin underlayment membranes like Schluter-Ditra on top of the OSB before tiling to be sure the tile doesn’t separate from the subfloor or crack.
January 14th, 2009 at 8:02 pm
Is there any reason to put an adhesive b/w the backerboard and the subfloor?
January 20th, 2009 at 5:42 pm
i want to install a ceramic tile floor in my apartment which is above my garage. i dont want to add alot of weight but i want a nice job done. what can you recomend. its a wood floor right now i just recently pulled up the old tile which was just stick ons.i would really appreciate your advice.
January 23rd, 2009 at 7:03 pm
Our floor seems to be 1×5s laid diagonally we want to lay 40×40cm ceramic tiles in our kitchen and dining room what is the best way to do this? Can we lay plywood sheets straight onto this and then start tiling? I think I need step by step help. Waiting to get advice from any one Thanks
January 27th, 2009 at 2:54 pm
What is the best mortar to use when tiling directly over tile? The floor is in very good shape…I just don’t like the tile and want something nicer. Also, any other advice you can share regarding tiling over tile would be appreciated.
February 7th, 2009 at 12:36 am
I have engineered wood flooring in my entry way that glued down to the slab/foundation . I want to install 1/2″ thick stone tiles on the top of the engineered wood surface. Can it be done? what is the recommendation for installation in this instance.
February 7th, 2009 at 2:16 pm
We are remodeling our living room and would like to put wood floor however, our subfloor is not leveled. How would we go about this? How do we fix a floor that is not leveled?
February 7th, 2009 at 9:32 pm
I would like to install my tile in my condo, but in order to do this I will need completely install the tile in one half of the condo, and then move everything to that side and then complete the other half. Is this okay to do? or will it cause problems in the future?
February 18th, 2009 at 4:45 pm
i have installed an 18 by 18 ceramic for a store in my home town. they have got me to tile overtop of a one side good fir plywood. now the job is failing is there anything i can do to the wood to make my tiles last longer?
March 1st, 2009 at 9:46 am
My kitchen floor is 3/4″ plywood over the joists, covered in 1/4″ luaun, with vinyl linoleum on top. Should I remove BOTH the vinyl and the 1/4″ underlayment before placing the cement backer board? If so, can I just cut the underlayment where it goes under the cabinets (which I am not going to tile underneath)? Thanks for your help!
March 7th, 2009 at 11:57 am
I am installing ceramic tile in a kitchen that was built in 1900. The wood floor boards are somewhat warped and not in the best of shape. I have removed several layers of luaun, tar paper and linoleum. I am left with many nails protruding through the 3″ floor boards. Rather than attempting to remove all of the nails and straighten out the floor boards, I am wondering if it is feasible for me to remove the floor boards and just place the cement boards directly over the subfloor. I am concerned that there may be too much flex in the subfloor between the joists.
Ben Erickson Says:March 9th, 2009 at 7:59 am
Michael,
Removing the wood flooring and adding a layer of cement backer board on top of the subfloor for tiling is certainly a possibility, but you are right to be concerned about flexing, as cement board adds little in the way of strength to the floor. It would depend on what center the joists are on, the thickness and material used for the subfloor, and the condition it is in. If you can deflect it by walking on it between the joists, you probably should add an additional layer of 1/2″ to 5/8″ plywood on top of the existing subfloor, before applying the cement board.
March 10th, 2009 at 8:53 pm
I am installing an electric heated floor on top of a concrete pad in a basement which ceramic tiles will then be placed overtop. I have been told that I should insulate the heating floor system from the concrete pad to prevent heat loss down into the pad and encourage it to move up into the tiles. A couple options considered are:
1. Install 1/4 inch cork by thin-setting it to the concrete pad, then installing the heating system by fastening it to the concrete pad (through the cork), followed by applying a self-leveling mortar over the cork and heating system and finally tiling over top that.
2. Lay down a vapour barrier overtop the concrete pad, then fasten 3/4 inch plywood using a Ramset to the concrete pad (through the vapor barrier), then install the heating system to the plywood, followed by applying the self-leveling mortar over top the heating system and plywood and finally installing the tiles over top that.
Does one system sound better then the other? Any suggestions?
Thanks,
Mark.
Ben Erickson Says:March 11th, 2009 at 7:31 am
Hi Mark,
For the under floor radiant heating system in our project house, we used treated plywood nailed to the slab, but that was more to have a way to attach the Uponor Quik Trak system than for insulation purposes. I would think the manufacturer of your system would be able to supply you with installation guidelines for it. For more info on the under floor heating system we used, check out our video on Installing Radiant Floor Heating and article Today’s Addition Nearing Completion.
March 14th, 2009 at 8:35 am
I’m installing ceramic tile on my bathroom floor. It’s currently covered with peel in stick vinyl squares and the floor underneath is old hardwood. I do not know exactly what condition the wood is in. I plan on pulling all the vinyl out, screwing down cement backerboard right on top of the hardwood, thinset mortar, and tile. Would you recommend anything else???
Ben Erickson Says:March 16th, 2009 at 7:20 am
Adam,
Sounds good to me. If the vinyl square are stuck down good, you could save yourself some trouble and leave them in place and screw the backer board down on top of them.
March 19th, 2009 at 9:15 am
We’re preparing to install tile in our kitchen and bathrooms. The kitchen is 20×22, and we’re going with 16×16 tiles. We intended on laying 1/2″ cement board over the subfloor prior to installing all of the tile, but were told by the main tile guy for the builder of our home that we don’t need to install the cement board in the kitchen. Apparently, our builder installs 1/2″ plywood over the subfloor in all rooms except in the baths and says it does just as good a job of holding up as cement board. I already ordered the cement board and am inclined to stick with it. Advice?
Ben Erickson Says:March 20th, 2009 at 7:15 am
Hi Susan,
I’m with you, I’d stick with cement backer board since the adhesion between it and the tile should be much better than with plywood.
March 20th, 2009 at 9:04 pm
We are planning to tile our kitchen this weekend. We have it all ready with concrete board. My question is how soon after you tile and grout can you move your stove and fridge back into the kitchen.
March 23rd, 2009 at 8:14 am
Question: I pulled up the tiles in my hallway and scraped off ALL the thinset. Now, the floor is 1/2 inch plyowwd over 3/4 inch subfloor. The floor is solid and the plywood really held the tiles on strong. It took me and my wife many hours to get them up and scrape the floor. I really don’t want to pull up the 1/2 inch plywood since it is SO solid. Can I install new tiles over this pre-existing plywood? I know backerboard is better these days, but didn’t they used to use plywood back in the day? I have read numerous websites on installing tile and about 1/2 say don’t use plywood and 1/2 say it is ok.
Advice please. Thanks.
John
March 23rd, 2009 at 8:17 am
Oh. one more thing, The tiles were down for seven years and we NEVER had a problem with then. I am just chaning them because we are installing ones with different color. We are remodeling. Thanks
March 23rd, 2009 at 10:52 am
Changed my mind. I am gonna rip up the old plywood and put down backerboard. People keep telling me to use liquid nails instead of thinset for below the backerboard. Will this work?
John
April 1st, 2009 at 9:54 pm
i wanted to share that i used the schluter ditra membrane that was discussed in some of these posts. it was my first tile job, and i cannot say more good things about it. it is very easy to cut (with scissors), and as soon as you lay it, you can lay tile over it. I installed it over my OSB subfloor in a bathroom. It was easy to work with, as the cellular membrane is flexible. i specified it for an architectural project (a college dormitory renovation to an old building), and it seems to be holding up very well. i am definately going to use it for my next bathroom!
it is easy to find at most home improvement stores…but it is a bit pricey
Allen Says:April 2nd, 2009 at 7:18 am
I’m so glad to hear that, Ingrid! As it happens, I’ll be installing a tile floor tomorrow for a segment in our show and I’ll be using the Ditra. Here’s a quick tip for anyone thinking about using it…If you’re using a latex-fortified adhesive, only use it between the membrane and plywood, but not between the membrane and tile. The latex doesn’t like to stick to the membrane material.
April 6th, 2009 at 12:07 pm
I am in the process of installing tiles in my kitchen floor. I leveled the subfloor with quick level thinset the best I could. Now after having installed the 1/4 inch backerboard i have realized the floor still has a few valleys and hills, is there a way to fix this? I am placing 18×18 tiles. Thank you
Ben Erickson Says:April 7th, 2009 at 7:11 am
Hi Alex,
You can use leveling compound to fill in the low spots, then tile over it once it has set.
May 15th, 2009 at 8:55 am
I’m installing a ceramic floor in my kitchen. There was a ceramic floor there before that’s been pulled up, no backer board, just a wood subfloor, is there any need to and/or anything available to seal the wood, without putting down backer? How did people lay ceramic flooring over wood subfloors BEFORE all this backer board stuff was invented?
Ben Erickson Says:May 18th, 2009 at 7:58 am
Hi Bryan,
Before backer board was used, the common method of laying a tile floor was to pour several inches of mortar on top of the subfloor. Once it had hardened, the tile was laid using thin-set on top of it.
May 22nd, 2009 at 6:24 pm
I have 5/8 inch solid subfloor over 16×16 joists OC. The floor is solid with absolutely no flexibility. It’s very stiff and sturdy. Everything I read pretty much says you need 1.125 inches of plywood for travertine. The contractor I had over today does loads and loads of jobs and he recommended a minimum 3/4 inch. I just don’t see the difference between my 5/8 and his recommended 3/4 being worth the extra cost and effort. Please tell me if a 5/8 subfloor CAN actually work with a 1/4 inch of hardibacker installed on top for a travertine install…
May 24th, 2009 at 11:54 pm
I want to install tile outdoors over a plywood deck. The plywood has a thick membrane type paint/coating on it. How should I proceed?
June 10th, 2009 at 9:28 pm
Thanks for the very informative site. I want to install 1″x1″ mosaic tile on a 4″ high backsplash behind my sink. The sink is on an island and the backsplash is the backside of a breakfast bar. The backsplash is made of 3/4″ maple and is finished with a varnish. From what I’ve been reading, it sounds like I shouldn’t apply the thinset directly to the wood. Is there an alternative to using a backerboard? The wood is only 3/4″ so there is not much depth to screw the backerboard to. Can I apply some waterproof primer to the wood and then apply the thinset to it? Thanks in advanced for any info.
Ben Erickson Says:June 11th, 2009 at 7:57 am
Hi KC,
I wouldn’t apply your tile to a solid wood backsplash since wood shrinks and expands as humidity and temperature levels change which would tend to pop the tile loose over time. If the wood backsplash is firmly attached, 3/4″ is plenty thick to screw backerboard into, or you could remove the existing backsplash and screw the backer through the drywall and into the studs.
Good luck with your project.
July 5th, 2009 at 11:43 pm
Same question as Hans Boerner asked on May 24th about laying external tile over a wooden deck, possibly using Ditra as a waterproofing underlayment over exterior plywood.
Any advice would be appreciated. Most tile installers tell me to forget it. But I have to believe the technology we have available now should solve the problems.
We live in Raleigh, NC, so the winters are relatively mild, although I can’t count out freezing rain and a fluke ice storm or snow.
Thanks,
Larry
Allen Says:July 6th, 2009 at 8:10 am
Hey Larry…
Actually, we just did that on a project out on the Fowl River in south Alabama. We used the 1/2-inch backer board instead of the Ditra. I can’t tell you why, but I just think the backer board would be better in an exterior situation. I’m probably being totally paranoid. I’ve used the Ditra in interior situations and absolutely love it. If you do opt for the Ditra, make sure it’s the thicker one. They came out with a new size this past year, I want to say they call it Ditra Ultra, but you want the original…just plain Ditra. Also, when you purchase the tile, make sure it’s porcelain tile, not ceramic.
July 8th, 2009 at 9:45 pm
Can i use self leveling cement over new 1/8″ cement backerboard? Afterward just tile over the cement???
Ben Erickson Says:July 9th, 2009 at 1:35 pm
Hi Russ,
Yes, you can use floor patch on top of cement backer board to level a subfloor, then tile over it.
July 13th, 2009 at 2:06 pm
What’s the difference between using wire-mesh with thinset versus Ditra? (I will be putting it over wood subfloor) Also, do you have to apply a thin layer of thinset underneath the Ditra before laying it? Thanks for the advice.
July 15th, 2009 at 3:51 pm
I purchased a 58 year old house and had to have the kitchen gutted and the joists and subfloor replaced. There currently are hills and valleys in the subfloor. It does not move when you walk on it, but isn’t level. I want to tile the floor but am concerned about trying to level it all before starting with the tile and backerboard. I have thought about a leveling compound but not am sure since the 3/4″ OSB floor meets up with the old 1×10s laid on 45s leaves holes all around the edges that the compound would pour out of. What would be your suggestion on moving forward with this kitchen renovation? What should I apply first, leveling compound or backerboard/ditra?
August 3rd, 2009 at 9:35 am
We are getting ready to install ceramic tile where we previously had linoleum. When we removed the linoleum, we found that there is wood subfloor under the majority of the floor that is in really good condition. However, at the edge of the kitchen, where it meets our breakfast room, there is a concrete step that is level with the existing wood subfloor (The breakfast room was an addition, so the step used to be the step to enter the house. With the linoleum, they had an extra threshhold where the concrete meets the wood. Will we have to keep that with the tile, or can we just continue the tile pattern there? I am worried that the wood will expand and contract at a different rate than the concrete.
Ben Erickson Says:August 4th, 2009 at 12:31 pm
Hi Dean,
Ditra is specifically made for floor tile applications. You do lay Ditra in a layer of thin-set fortified with latex, then apply another layer of thin-set (without latex additive) on top of it to lay the tile. You can watch it being done, and read more about it in our episode on Flooring Solutions for Your Home.
August 16th, 2009 at 3:52 pm
Our bathroom had vinal flooring. After removing the flooring and 1/2 inch plywood,there was 1/6 inch diag. sheeting. Can I just use 1/2 inch backer board on top of the 1/6 and lay my floor tile on top of that. Thanks in advance.
August 17th, 2009 at 7:43 pm
I want to install porcelain tile in Kitchen, hall and bath.
I’ve taken the floor down to the plank subfloor. ( t&G 2×6 )
Can I just lay 1/2 hardibacker over that or is neccessary to also install plywood befor the backer board??
Ben Erickson Says:August 19th, 2009 at 11:10 am
Hi Richard,
Since a solid wood subfloor can cup and move with changes in humidity, it’s best to screw the boards down well, then screw 1/2″ plywood (exterior glue) down, followed by a layer of cement backer board.
September 15th, 2009 at 1:25 am
It should be noted that it is okay to use a Gypsum board for flooring or counter tops only and NEVER for a shower or areas that tend to get wet frequently. Most tile product companies do not warranty a installation on gypsum board in a shower or water areas– even if waterproofed properly. Think of what happens to cardboard when you get it wet.
September 16th, 2009 at 12:36 pm
Dan,
I am replacing a glass enclosed corner shower with a low threshold type shower that uses a weighted curtain versus a glass enclosure. I am concerned about water escaping the shower and would like to install a tile floor. Currently the floor is constructed two layers of 1/2″ OSB with glued vinyl floor covering. If I remove one layer of OSB and put down 1/4″ hardibacker along with a waterproof membrane and then install the tile my floor level will be the close to where it started but will one layer of OSB be sufficiently rigid?
Ben Erickson Says:September 17th, 2009 at 9:08 am
Mark,
Exterior grade plywood is the preferred subfloor under tile rather than OSB, since it deflects less and is more resistant to water and moisture. A plywood subfloor should be a minimum of 5/8″ thick (depending on joist spacing) topped by 1/2″ cement backer board. You can find detailed information on subfloors under tile at http://www.thetiledoctor.com/installations/floors.cfm
September 22nd, 2009 at 4:40 pm
We had a tile floor put in our kitchen and both bathrooms and hate it. We want it removed so we can put vinyl or hardwood back down. We must do it ourselves in order to afford it. It was over a wood subfloor so cement backer board from Lowe’s was put down under it then it was attached using grout. My husband & I are neither physically able to do it but must so what is the easiest way to do it? What equipment would help? We are not at all experienced so any advice would be appreciated! Thanks!
September 24th, 2009 at 11:43 am
First, thank you so much for your web site. It is a wonderful resource for those of us who prefer to do our own work. I have learned a lot and I am so glad I found you before going forward. My house is 46 years old and on a concrete slab foundation. The garage portion (next to the kitchen) is 4 ¼ inches lower than the rest. We have tiled the kitchen with ceramic tile and now wish to continue the tile into what was the garage but will now be the laundry room. So after reading your message board I tried to come up with a plan for the sub-floor. How does this sound?
1. Build a structure of 2X3’s with 8 inches of space between the boards. The 2×3’s would be standing up on their side so that the height is actually 2 ½ inches.
2. Lay down ¾ inch exterior plywood and screw into the 2×3’s every 8 inches.
3. Lay down ½ inch exterior plywood (the opposite direction) and screw to the ¾ inch plywood but not the 2×3’s.
4. Apply un-modified thin set on top of the plywood.
5. Lay down ½ inch Hardy Backer Board leaving 1/8 inch gaps between and ¼ inch around the outside edges. Screw it down with those big backer board screws and apply the mesh tape & thin set to the gaps.
That all adds up to 4 ¼ inches which will give me the proper height. Originally I was going to use 2X4’s for the bottom structure which would have been 3 ½ inches high, ½ inch plywood, and ¼ inch backer board, for a total of 4 ¼ inches. But, after reading your message board I realized that I would not have 1 1/8 inch minimum under the tile. With the scenario above I will have
1 ¾ inches under the tile. Is that too much? Also, if you have a better suggestion please let me know. I eagerly await your response.
September 24th, 2009 at 8:27 pm
I am a “handywoman” and plan to install a bathroom in my basement, doing as much of the construction as I am capable of doing. I want to put in a tile floor and it will be installed over the poured concrete basement slab. I will remove the existing toilet before tiling and will also have the lavatory/vanity installed after the floor is tiled.
I have 2 questions.
First… When the original concrete floor was poured, the temp. dropped below freezing that night so parts of the top surface spalled and crumbled. The builder came back and put a layer of Armstrong brand S-172 Floor Patch and Skim Coat over the basement floor, but several areas now sound “hollow” when you walk on them, including areas where the new bathroom will be. I don’t feel comfortable installing tile over the hollow-sounding skim coat surface. Should I try to break up and remove the skim coat in those areas and use proper installation techniques for tile over concrete slab or can I trust the skim coat layer? I watched them apply the skim coat and they did not use any type of concrete-to-concrete bonding solution of any type (of course, I don’t know if that was necessary or not) and it happened too long ago to ask them to fix it now.
Second.. I will be having a new tub/shower unit installed. Should I install new tile under the area where the new tub unit will sit or should I install the tub/shower, then tile up to it and put some type of base trim at the tub/floor edge?
Thanks for any information you can give me.
Ben Erickson Says:September 25th, 2009 at 8:22 am
Hi Mitzi,
Regarding your first question, if the existing skimmed over concrete appears to be solid and in good condition, I would tile over it. However, it sounds like from you description it may not be adhering well, in which case you may be able to hit it with a sledge hammer (not too hard) and break it up while leaving the bottom layer of concrete in place.
On the second question, while it doesn’t hurt to tile the floor under the tub/shower unit, it’s a waste of time and money, so I would install the tub, then tile up to it and caulk where they meet with silicone caulking. Installing a molding where they meet would just be an invitation to water from the tub/shower getting behind it and rotting the molding over time.
Good luck with your project!
Ben Erickson Says:September 25th, 2009 at 8:43 am
Hi Robin,
While your plan sounds fine, I would use pressure treated wood for the 2×3s in case there is a moisture problem with the garage floor. As far as the thickness of the subfloor goes, the 1 1/8″ minimum thickness includes the 1/2″ cement backer board, so you could get by with one thick layer of plywood (5/8″ or 3/4″ thick) topped by cement backer board with wider joists under it to make up the difference. Using two layers of plywood as you mentioned is fine, but it would add more to the cost. See my Sept. 17, 2009 post above for more info on subfloor thickness including a link to a good article on the subject.
Good luck with your project!
September 26th, 2009 at 3:29 pm
Laying travertine over resilient flooring – I did a ton of research on this and as well as on deflection and FINALLY decided to go ahead and lay right on top of my resilient flooring. Of course first I installed the HardiBacker board. With the use of the mortar and all the nails required to install the HardiBacker board that resilient flooring isn’t moving ANYWHERE. My floor came out beautifully and I used the 18″ X 18″ travertine tiles. It was my first home project ever…and I nailed it!! Time will tell on how it wears, but I really feel that it is there for good and there will not be any problems down the road. It was a fairly large job too 315 square feet…Whatever you do don’t skimp on the mortar, that larger tile needs a big thick mortar base.
Ben Erickson Says:September 28th, 2009 at 9:47 am
Way to go, Mark!
Sounds like you got it right the first time. It’s important to use cement backer board to ensure a good bond between the tile and subfloor. Thanks for the feedback.
October 7th, 2009 at 5:48 pm
I am currently working on putting tile in our bathroom and need to take up the particle board that has linoleum on it to be replaced with cement backer board. The problem is that the particle board runs under the vanity. How do you suggest I cut the particle board so that it is flush with the bottom of the vanity?
October 18th, 2009 at 4:08 pm
Not an official answer, but I know that stuff is usually fairly thin (at least it was under the vinyl at my house). You might be able to deeply score it with a box cutter and pry it up with a screwdriver or similar tool.
October 19th, 2009 at 9:23 pm
I work in a snowboard shop and we are working on a special project. We are going to cut up old snowboards and tile them in our entry way (about 8′x8′). However, due to door clearance issues, there is not enough room for a backer board. Since this isn’t actually tile, would we be ok to attach directly to the sub-floor and what would you recommend for the best bond? Also, do you think grout would still be appropriate between ’tiles’? Any other tips with this unique project?
October 20th, 2009 at 7:59 am
I am installing porcelain tile in my kitchen. My existing flooring is 3/4″ Advantech subfloor with a 1/4″ layer of luan that is glued solid and stapled every 1-2 inches to it. (1) Can I screw the HardiBacker board over the luan and subfloor? (2) Do I have to apply a layer of thinset on top of the luan before laying the HardiBacker, or can I just screw the HardiBacker down? Any advice would be GREATLY appreciated! Thanks in advance.
Ben Erickson Says:October 21st, 2009 at 8:39 am
Hi Darren,
While it’s a good idea to adhere the backer board to the subfloor with thin-set as well as screwing it down, it’s usually not required as long as the 6″-8″ screwing pattern is followed. Check your local building codes to be sure.
October 21st, 2009 at 9:47 am
Ben,
Thanks for the reply. I am following the screwing pattern that is designated on the Hardiebacker Board with 1.25″ screws (which is the total thickness of the subfloor, luan, and HardieBacker. Wish me luck.
October 21st, 2009 at 5:33 pm
I agree this is a really great site. I am a big DIYer and haave recently remodeled my master bathroom and half bath. The stairs leading from my lower level in my condo I want to replace with ceramic tile and it has a plywood subfloor. I wanted to know if there is anything special to doing tile on stairs versus on a regular flat floor. The tile store I went to showed me a metal trim I need to use versus the bullnose since this should not be stepped on. I was looking for a step by step on installing tile on plywood stairs. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Qeta
Ben Erickson Says:October 22nd, 2009 at 8:07 am
Darren,
You may want to drive some longer screws into the joists as well.
October 22nd, 2009 at 8:34 am
Ben,
Drive longer screws through the backerboard into the joists, or put longer screws through the subfloor into the joinst BEFORE laying the backerboard?
Ben Erickson Says:October 23rd, 2009 at 8:32 am
Hi Darren,
Actually I was thinking of driving them through the backer board into the joists, but either approach would work.
October 23rd, 2009 at 3:05 pm
I am installing ceramic tile in a 10 x 10 kitchen with diagonal plank sub floor and tongue & groove hardwood floor. Floor joists are on 16″ centers. Can I thinset and screw the 1/4″ backer board to hardwood floor? I was told this was not a good idea. It seems to me that the more the structure under the tile the better. Am I wrong? The floor seems solid and I plan on installing many screws into the underlying joists
October 26th, 2009 at 10:11 pm
Wow! I am so happy to have found this site It ’s proven to be a valuable resource and I am grateful for any info. Anyhoo, I gutted my bathroom down to the studs and I’m moving right along with the remodeling. I have 1/2″ plywood over 16″ O.C. floor joists. I’d like to put 1/2″ Hardibacker board before tiling but every thing I’ve read seems to indicate I need to put down more plywood. Is that so? If I put more down, what would I need: 1/2″? 3/4″? Could I avoid doing so altogether by simply using Shuler Ditra? Thanks in advance for any info.
Ben Erickson Says:October 27th, 2009 at 8:41 am
Hi Dennis,
Glad to hear that our site has been a help. Most building codes call for a 11/8″ thick subfloor including the backer board. That means a minimum of 5/8″ plywood topped by 1/2″ backer board. Since backer board adds little in the way of strength to the floor, having thick enough plywood is important. If it doesn’t cause your floor to get too high, I would add a second layer of 1/2″ plywood, topped by either backer board or a membrane like Ditra. Or you could tear out the existing subfloor and put down one layer of 5/8″ plywood (topped by backer or membrane) instead. If you look back at my Sept. 17, 2009, reply, you’ll find a link to a website that has more detailed info on subfoor thickness. Good luck with your project!
October 27th, 2009 at 1:25 pm
I’ve read many of the questions but can’t find one that exactly addresses my situation. I want to put 18 X 18 X 7/16 Travertine in one of our bathrooms. I ripped up the vinyl to find 1/2 inch plywood over 3/4 inch plywood subfloor. Even if I remove the 1/2 inch plywood the new surface will be between 1/4 and 1/2 inch above the adjacent floor(1/4 inch backer, 2 layers of thinset, 7/16 inch Travertine). That’s unacceptable, besides my wife would kill me! Any suggestions???
October 28th, 2009 at 6:59 am
Hi Ben, and thanks for the prompt and concise response. It’s greatly appreciated! BTW, based on what you said, I may simply swap out the 1/2″ backer board for 1/4″ stuff due to potential floor height issues. Thanks again!
November 4th, 2009 at 6:48 pm
Ben,
So right now the Kitchen floor has thin vinyl tile squares. Not sure what is underneath. I am going to remove the tiles before installing ceramic tiles. If I put that backer board down first and then the ceramic tile, won’t that raise the floor up too much in comparison to the wood floors in the dining room and hall?
Thanks
Ben Erickson Says:November 5th, 2009 at 9:59 am
Hi Barry,
If adding backer board will make the floor higher than you would like, you could consider using one of the thin new underlayment membranes instead. You can out more in our Best New Product video on Tile Underlayment Membrane and our DIY video on How to Tile a Floor Using an Underlayment Membrane. Good luck with your project!
November 5th, 2009 at 10:13 pm
dear,Danny
im looking to install porclen tile in my parents home the house is about 40+ years old my dad lacks the exsperence in this area i know alil the flood in not all that cracked up to be well its not all great at all like i said its a old house i guess my question would be can we ues 1/4 backer board and what could i fill the holes in the floors to make it even to lay the backerboard down
thanks rusty
November 7th, 2009 at 1:07 pm
I am redoing my upstairs bathroom and want to put in ceramic tile. The previous owner had 5/8 subfloor that had an 1/8 inch spacing between the sheets of plywood. The shower leaked and rotted the floor a little, so I replaced the subfloor with a 5/8 inch osb subfloor. I went to a tile store and the guy said they recomend to put another 5/8 inch plywood down for support of the subfloor. I guess I am confused, what type of subfloor and how thick should I use for ceramic tile? Thanks Joe